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Shadows...



Joined: 23 Aug 2015
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rthdx wrote:
Shadows... wrote:
You should try some of the ciders i listed above...
Well, "Blasphemous" might not quite be the word i'd use but personally i don't think years and years of tradition would ever be forgotten by some new experiment. All being said, i'm sure it wasn't a bad taste. did it have a malt taste to the cider? richer? more bitter?
As i wrote...try some of the above if you can.

Which ciders have you tried? (English/British)

From imported ones mainly French ones as they are way more spread here. And I'm afraid that I'll be able to locate stuff from your list only in some boutique. Quick googling gave this result. But they're only selling packs.

Dry hopping added obvious bitterness and aroma. Definitely not a beer taste, but not a cider as well. Better to call it fusion.



From the list "Westons - Wyld Wood" is about the best you will get or the Westons Vintage.
How are the French ciders?
Yeah, doesn't sound too promising with the hops hah.
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rthdx



Joined: 29 Apr 2010
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Location: Korolev, Russia

PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shadows... wrote:
How are the French ciders?

Many brut sorts, usually not big alcohol levels. Good for hot weather when you still plan to do something besides drinking. Smile
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Shadows...



Joined: 23 Aug 2015
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rthdx wrote:
Shadows... wrote:
How are the French ciders?

Many brut sorts, usually not big alcohol levels. Good for hot weather when you still plan to do something besides drinking. Smile


Nice.
Our stuff tends to be 7/8 % for a good cider so it;s hard going if you are looking to play a game of tennis after 3-4 pints Laughing

What i am drinking as i type this is 6.8% ..but it's doesn't taste heavy! it's more like an Apple white wine. this is East country stuff ...the West is a bit more "full" on flavour. (more popular too) apparently the Eastern Cider dates back to around 1200 AD. Is there no other way to get ahold of other good ciders from the UK?
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rthdx



Joined: 29 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shadows... wrote:
Nice.
Our stuff tends to be 7/8 % for a good cider so it;s hard going if you are looking to play a game of tennis after 3-4 pints Laughing

The strongest one I've tried was 13% Ice Cider, it had minimal carbonization, and was closer to wine. But that was draft-only limited edition, no bottled version for maturing or making generous gifts...
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Shadows...



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rthdx wrote:
Shadows... wrote:
Nice.
Our stuff tends to be 7/8 % for a good cider so it;s hard going if you are looking to play a game of tennis after 3-4 pints Laughing

The strongest one I've tried was 13% Ice Cider, it had minimal carbonization, and was closer to wine. But that was draft-only limited edition, no bottled version for maturing or making generous gifts...


Yeah that's Cider on steroids! Laughing not even sure if it'd classify as a Cider after about 9%. the strongest i;ve had is 8.5%.
Any idea what it was called?
How did it taste?
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rthdx



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shadows... wrote:
Yeah that's Cider on steroids! Laughing not even sure if it'd classify as a Cider after about 9%. the strongest i;ve had is 8.5%.
Any idea what it was called?
How did it taste?

It was manufactured by most known local cider brand St. Anton from late sorts of apples. It was dry and alcohol was pretty hidden in the body. Such strength was reached by freezing off water (like with 26% Eisbock I've posted previously), so it's not traditional technology indeed. But as I've mentioned, I'm open for experiments. Wink
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Shadows...



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rthdx wrote:
Shadows... wrote:
Yeah that's Cider on steroids! Laughing not even sure if it'd classify as a Cider after about 9%. the strongest i;ve had is 8.5%.
Any idea what it was called?
How did it taste?

It was manufactured by most known local cider brand St. Anton from late sorts of apples. It was dry and alcohol was pretty hidden in the body. Such strength was reached by freezing off water (like with 26% Eisbock I've posted previously), so it's not traditional technology indeed. But as I've mentioned, I'm open for experiments. Wink


Hah, yes i have heard of this method. I do think a lot of the white ciders are done in a somewhat similar way. I guess you have heard of these ciders?
Frosty Jacks, White Ace, White Lightning...etc
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=white+cider&oq=white+cider&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.2064j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Of-course i'm going to say ..avoid at all costs hah.
It's the stuff kids drink at 15 and soon regret when it all comes back up to haunt them. Now at 25-28 they won't touch real cider because of the memory and how (crazily) they would affiliate this crap with cider.
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rthdx



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shadows... wrote:
Hah, yes i have heard of this method. I do think a lot of the white ciders are done in a somewhat similar way. I guess you have heard of these ciders?
Frosty Jacks, White Ace, White Lightning...etc
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=white+cider&oq=white+cider&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.2064j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Of-course i'm going to say ..avoid at all costs hah.
It's the stuff kids drink at 15 and soon regret when it all comes back up to haunt them. Now at 25-28 they won't touch real cider because of the memory and how (crazily) they would affiliate this crap with cider.

Hehe, no, haven't heard of them, seems like an analogue of our alcoholic/energy cocktails (popular among kids and bums too), but at least those ones are pretending to be made from natural ore, unlike mentioned chemical poison. My old fellow once almost got pancreas necrosis due to addiction for that crap. As the result now can drink only vodka. But I guess freezing off is doubtfully the process used to make those cheap white ciders, as it's rather expensive technology. Most likely they just add needed amount of Ethanol on the final stage...
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Shadows...



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

rthdx wrote:
Shadows... wrote:
Hah, yes i have heard of this method. I do think a lot of the white ciders are done in a somewhat similar way. I guess you have heard of these ciders?
Frosty Jacks, White Ace, White Lightning...etc
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=white+cider&oq=white+cider&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.2064j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Of-course i'm going to say ..avoid at all costs hah.
It's the stuff kids drink at 15 and soon regret when it all comes back up to haunt them. Now at 25-28 they won't touch real cider because of the memory and how (crazily) they would affiliate this crap with cider.

Hehe, no, haven't heard of them, seems like an analogue of our alcoholic/energy cocktails (popular among kids and bums too), but at least those ones are pretending to be made from natural ore, unlike mentioned chemical poison. My old fellow once almost got pancreas necrosis due to addiction for that crap. As the result now can drink only vodka. But I guess freezing off is doubtfully the process used to make those cheap white ciders, as it's rather expensive technology. Most likely they just add needed amount of Ethanol on the final stage...


Hah these fucking "ciders" are closer to bleach than they are cider.
Yeah, they are just propped up sugar which in turn ferments (by sugar...i mean added sugar , not natural) and colouring/e number shit ...of-course this stuff has a massively high alcohol content due to the fermented sugar (added) which in turn causes all sorts of problems. avoidable at all costs ..hah.

How do you get on with the Russian Imperial Stouts? now those i would like to try!"!!
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rthdx



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shadows... wrote:
How do you get on with the Russian Imperial Stouts? now those i would like to try!"!!

Hm, in fact RIS has British origin! Wink It was created in 18th century by request of Ekaterina II, as only strong and highly hopped beer was possible to deliver to Russian Empire in fine condition. It's very dense and full-bodied drink with alcohol starting from 9% (usually more), so not very suitable for consuming by gallons. Smile Plus RIS belong to premium segment (especially barrel-aged modifications), so I haven't met any idiot yet who decided to get shitfaced with them. Very Happy Maybe some history lovers still make them in GB? Not very sure, in context of especially warm geopolitical interactions between our countries during last century. Laughing
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Shadows...



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rthdx wrote:
Shadows... wrote:
How do you get on with the Russian Imperial Stouts? now those i would like to try!"!!

Hm, in fact RIS has British origin! Wink It was created in 18th century by request of Ekaterina II, as only strong and highly hopped beer was possible to deliver to Russian Empire in fine condition. It's very dense and full-bodied drink with alcohol starting from 9% (usually more), so not very suitable for consuming by gallons. Smile Plus RIS belong to premium segment (especially barrel-aged modifications), so I haven't met any idiot yet who decided to get shitfaced with them. Very Happy Maybe some history lovers still make them in GB? Not very sure, in context of especially warm geopolitical interactions between our countries during last century. Laughing


Hah yeah, i know Courage did an imperial stout and also Fullers did too..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJCRSOT3sbs 10.7% is quite a hit!!
Obviously not a drink to get shitfaced on ...well, unless you like to have your stomach pumped! hah. 8.5% is the heaviest ale/.stout i've drunk ..called OLD TOM. have you tried it? it's like port in a stout ..with an ale mouth feel. great stuff, but of-course not a drink to session on.. (unless you are into hospital food hah)
I know there was some history from the Brits concerning the Imperial stout ..oh how i;d love to try it but getting a hold of this kind of stuff is hard to find. (unfortunately) Give that video a watch and see what you think.

Currently drinking Wilkins Cider (real cider fresh from the farm) fucking amazingly great scrumpy with no additives/bullshit.
Here's a cider doc to watch if you are interested...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8B0Uy4KWziE 10:36 HAHA
Frank Naish was the oldest Cider maker in this country.

What are you drinking at present?
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rthdx



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shadows... wrote:
8.5% is the heaviest ale/.stout i've drunk ..called OLD TOM. have you tried it? it's like port in a stout ..
I know there was some history from the Brits concerning the Imperial stout ..oh how i;d love to try it but getting a hold of this kind of stuff is hard to find. (unfortunately) Give that video a watch and see what you think.

I've almost excluded imported drinks from ration since craft revolution came here (circa 5 years ago) due to plain economic reasons (that also had much to do with serious change of currency rates in last years). The obvious exclusion is for certain distillates, but since in last couple years distilleries became supported on state level in Belarus, I'm getting quality and cheap analogues (Calvados, grappa etc) there. Also I'm helping an old classmate to make own moonshine lately, so the problem of extra expenses is rather solved. In fact I try to spend 80% of my budget for the label...
Returning back to RIS, these days almost every self-respecting small local brewery do it here as a sort of prove of their abilities/quality/status, so they are not hard to be located in decent assortment. On latest BCD (posted a link before) at least half of participants represented Imperial Stouts, hehe. The strongest RIS I've consumed until now is "Булгаков" (Brewlok Brewery) 15.7% (with 35% OG), also posted above. Wink
But as for distribution of local craft in outer world, it's very limited, I guess I've only heard that Estonia managed to establish limited supply yet.

Shadows... wrote:
Currently drinking Wilkins Cider (real cider fresh from the farm) fucking amazingly great scrumpy with no additives/bullshit.
Here's a cider doc to watch if you are interested...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8B0Uy4KWziE 10:36 HAHA
Frank Naish was the oldest Cider maker in this country.

What are you drinking at present?

Thanks for the vid, will look for sure... I'm on orange juice+mineral water since Tuesday. Smile Had very dense weekend, plus I almost never go to internet to write on forums when into anything stronger than low-alcohol stuff. Otherwise I'm gonna be banned everywhere, having bad temper, you know... Very Happy
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Shadows...



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rthdx wrote:
Shadows... wrote:
8.5% is the heaviest ale/.stout i've drunk ..called OLD TOM. have you tried it? it's like port in a stout ..
I know there was some history from the Brits concerning the Imperial stout ..oh how i;d love to try it but getting a hold of this kind of stuff is hard to find. (unfortunately) Give that video a watch and see what you think.

I've almost excluded imported drinks from ration since craft revolution came here (circa 5 years ago) due to plain economic reasons (that also had much to do with serious change of currency rates in last years). The obvious exclusion is for certain distillates, but since in last couple years distilleries became supported on state level in Belarus, I'm getting quality and cheap analogues (Calvados, grappa etc) there. Also I'm helping an old classmate to make own moonshine lately, so the problem of extra expenses is rather solved. In fact I try to spend 80% of my budget for the label...
Returning back to RIS, these days almost every self-respecting small local brewery do it here as a sort of prove of their abilities/quality/status, so they are not hard to be located in decent assortment. On latest BCD (posted a link before) at least half of participants represented Imperial Stouts, hehe. The strongest RIS I've consumed until now is "Булгаков" (Brewlok Brewery) 15.7% (with 35% OG), also posted above. Wink
But as for distribution of local craft in outer world, it's very limited, I guess I've only heard that Estonia managed to establish limited supply yet.

Shadows... wrote:
Currently drinking Wilkins Cider (real cider fresh from the farm) fucking amazingly great scrumpy with no additives/bullshit.
Here's a cider doc to watch if you are interested...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8B0Uy4KWziE 10:36 HAHA
Frank Naish was the oldest Cider maker in this country.

What are you drinking at present?

Thanks for the vid, will look for sure... I'm on orange juice+mineral water since Tuesday. Smile Had very dense weekend, plus I almost never go to internet to write on forums when into anything stronger than low-alcohol stuff. Otherwise I'm gonna be banned everywhere, having bad temper, you know... Very Happy


Hah, we all have to take a few days off the booze. I'm off to work in 10 minutes and feeling a little "light" right now. (I had around 7 pints of Scrumpy last night) so i'll be good tonight and stick to drink without the alcohol Laughing

Wow, that's quite an ABV hah ...how many of those did you manage to drink?
How is the moon-shining going? brewing is something i will be doing in the coming months. (cider making is probably the better wording/terminology) i'll try to get a 20-30 litre press and go from there.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shadows... wrote:
Wow, that's quite an ABV hah ...how many of those did you manage to drink?

...one! Laughing 5 Euro for 0.33L is already far above my moral barrier of wasting, but in certain cases it's impossible to resist.

Shadows... wrote:
How is the moon-shining going?

Unhurriedly and obviously only in sober mode, otherwise there is risk to waste a bunch of time for preparation and distil some stinky loathsome tasted druff. Quality stuff takes time and efforts; with first distillation you get raw alcohol (60-70%), then the best is to tincture it on pear or apple chips, add the needed aromatic components you'd like to be present in the final product. Then the second distillery (made from 20% mix of raw alcohol and water) is the most complex process, as you have to bear off different fractions thoroughly in slow mode in order to throw away heads (acetone, fusel oils etc.) and tails (low alcohol ends to add to future distillation brews). Then it's better to handle stuff on charcoal crumb, filter off, pour with water to needed strength (42-45% if you do not plan to make further tincture on fruits, vegetables, whatever; 50-55% if doing tincture, as the more components you add for maturing, the more alcohol you loose) and in any case leave at least for 2 weeks for hydration (diffusion between spirits and water). So all that is done obviously not because we don't have funds to get drunk, decent vodka here is just 10-12 Euro for 1L bottle. Wink

Shadows... wrote:
(cider making is probably the better wording/terminology) i'll try to get a 20-30 litre press and go from there.

Well, if you ever reach larger amounts or will be unsatisfied with final result, you can always distil your cider, put into oak cask and get your own Calvados! Cool
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Shadows...



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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hah 5euros for a 33cl bottle is expensive ..i can see why you only drank one.
Good luck with the moonshine, it certainly sounds like an interesting process.
Cider is (or atleast looks) very simple, it's 5-6 steps really, no removing yeast etc or any other trivial bullshit. for me it's simply getting the apples ..there's local farms here so i'll speak with a few farmers and see what i can do.
If i can oak barrel my cider that would be great..i'd need to read into that a little more though. What other alcohol have you tried making?

Hah, is vodka really that cheap there?
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