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should black metal bands worry about the (nazi) past
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Ashmonger



Joined: 01 Mar 2012
Posts: 424

PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, I saw this Demoniac interview posted on facebook and I had never heard of Grim Kim/Kim Kelly. There also was a link to her FB profile. So I check it out and the first thing I see is a pic of her wearing a Demonic Christ t-shirt. Not exactly a ns-band, but I seemed to remember an old interview in which some un-pc things were said. It took me less than 5 minutes to find that interview again.
I personally don't give a fuck about whether or not a band is ns or not, but first I was confused. Then I came to the conclusion that someone should learn to be a bit consequent.
Also, as said by other people: you really expect Black/Death Metal to be inoffensive?!
Fuck this shit!
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DTBRex



Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 1:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

However, lest it be forgotten in this thread: You can't just blame the PC whiners, be them punks or hipsters or brothers of metal or whatever, for this situation. You have to blame many Black Metal-bands too, who actually want to be embraced by mainstream media, who want to play on big festivals, who want to have their releases and merch available in walmart too.

That's when all the feeble excuses and backpedaling starts, see Inquisition recently. "Grim Kelly" comes inquiring about your racist and homophobic lyrics from ten years ago? Tell her to fist herself to death, and be done with it. Why do so many Black Metal-bands lack the balls and spine to actually own up to what they once said and did, but rather make a fool of themselves by trying to explain things away, by excusing themselves for having been "teenagers who just wanted to provoke", by asking to be pardoned by people who never were nor are part of Black Metal to begin with?

This weakness is subsequently exploited by the Antifa and others who wish to impose their ridiculous "moral codes" and "political outlook" on Black Metal too.

You can be a Neo-Nazi and a global pop icon all the same. Ask Varg how it's done.
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harmless



Joined: 13 Nov 2007
Posts: 2146
Location: 101 Reykjavík, Iceland.

PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 1:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Questioning nazism or racism does not
mean you are a communist or an uber-liberal.
Can you not ask such questions is a Burzum
or Demonic Christ T-shirt is found in your
closet? Both have expressed racial views
in the past.
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DTBRex



Joined: 04 Mar 2009
Posts: 3335
Location: Arktogäa

PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 2:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

harmless wrote:
Questioning nazism or racism does not
mean you are a communist or an uber-liberal.


Rolling Eyes Questioning the existence of extremist views such as "racism" and "nazism" in Black Metal, and actually going so far as writing "Black Metal still has a problem with racism", as Vice magazine did recently, just proves your lack of insight into, and affiliation to, this particular genre/scene. Regardless of your own political outlook/agenda.

If anyone has a serious grievance with NS-references in music and lyric, then Black Metal is the absolutely wrong genre for you. And any attempt at "cleansing" the scene by starting pathetic witchhunts does nothing but backfire, as can be read in this thread loud and clear.
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TCM



Joined: 02 Feb 2012
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 3:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

blewcheer wrote:
Carlzilla wrote:
The PC ex-punk crowd should be ejected from black metal, forcibly.

That seems to be where all the witch-hunt and guilt by association bullshit begins these days...


This man has the right idea.

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Exitium



Joined: 01 Dec 2011
Posts: 1433
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 4:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This:

blewcheer wrote:
I have a real problem with the idea that extreme views cannot be expressed through black metal, as I'm sure anyone who has been involved for longer than 15-20 years can agree. I just cannot take this retarded shit seriously. The saddest part of the entire thing is that these cunts legitimately do not realize they are outsiders. The moment you start questioning extreme views from a moralist perspective in black metal, YOU SHOULD REALIZE YOU HAVE NO PLACE IN IT. The rest of us, who grew up within this scene, who have fully embraced it as part of who we are, simply ignore a band we don't like or a style/lyrical subject we're not interested in (notice I didn't say offended by).
The real black metal scene was never populated by faggots who wrote blogs about cisgender identity, it was full of sarcastic fucking dicks who could laugh at anything, mock anything, and not give a fuck. Look around at how many of your heroes have chosen to backtrack and go on the defensive when asked about this basic shit, by the way. It's really unfortunate that it turned out like this.


DTBRex wrote:
However, lest it be forgotten in this thread: You can't just blame the PC whiners, be them punks or hipsters or brothers of metal or whatever, for this situation. You have to blame many Black Metal-bands too, who actually want to be embraced by mainstream media, who want to play on big festivals, who want to have their releases and merch available in walmart too.


Lest we forget


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Wear your cunted out black metal shirts while practicing occult rituals like burning sage and posting quotes from Aleister Crowley on facebook.
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lifeless



Joined: 02 Nov 2008
Posts: 825
Location: deep space crime, toronto

PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 4:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"HILL THE ARIAN RACE" LOL
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holy ghost



Joined: 16 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wilding wrote:
GoldenBull wrote:
Carlzilla wrote:
It seems most people who commented on my original post got the point, but I want to state this before someone gets all uppity...

I like punk, I like hardcore...but they and black metal are two very different beasts, and what is standard in one scene is not standard in the next. Trying to force the prejudices and preconceptions about aesthetic and language choices that exist in the punk scene on the world of black metal is going to make a lot bands into whipping boys for the PC crowd, when the reality of the situation is a lot more complex and much different.

They hold completely different ideologies. We'd probably all laugh a band off the board if they claimed to be "black metal for total equality"...because many of us grew up understanding the inherent anti-human and elitist values that almost always tend to run hand in hand with black metal. The punk rock crowd that invaded the scene over the last 5-10 years have not...they grew up in a scene that very often strived (usually unsuccessfully mind you) for equality...and they want to force that familiar outlook into whatever they get involved in after they move on (or branch out) from punk/hardcore.


I actually think these people at least partially ruined punk too.

Exhibit A: The 1990s.


Looks like you'll want to read this interesting zine about oppression with your vegan brownie?
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lifeless



Joined: 02 Nov 2008
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Location: deep space crime, toronto

PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 5:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DTBRex wrote:

You can be a Neo-Nazi and a global pop icon all the same. Ask Varg how it's done.


or the biebs! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWnArgbYF6E
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worldeater



Joined: 01 Aug 2014
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 5:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TCM wrote:
blewcheer wrote:
Carlzilla wrote:
The PC ex-punk crowd should be ejected from black metal, forcibly.

That seems to be where all the witch-hunt and guilt by association bullshit begins these days...


This man has the right idea.
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Kojiri



Joined: 26 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lifeless wrote:
"HILL THE ARIAN RACE" LOL


Laughing
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DTBRex



Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 6:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kojiri wrote:
lifeless wrote:
"HILL THE ARIAN RACE" LOL


Laughing


This here ought to be made mandatory reading for anyone who doesn't want to believe that Norwegian Black Metal was a hotbed for xenophobic ejaculations (hrhr) back in the 1990ties:

Stian Arnesen wrote:
All immigrants should be shot for desertion and treason to their own country. They are nothing but weak subhumans which lack honour, respect, and certainly pride.


etc.pp.

http://de.scribd.com/doc/181834182/Infernus-4-Nordic-Holocaust-1996
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BaronOvHell



Joined: 28 Jun 2011
Posts: 233
Location: DOVER NH

PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The article on Dragonforce almost reads like satire poking fun at other metal witch hunts... but there is a time and place for that and it isn't on Vice and it isn't for the Vice's audience to appreciate.

Maybe she felt it was double-edged and metal heads would understand it for the comedic absurdity that any band can be dragged through the mud; while on the other hand ruining the reputation of a band she considers 'false' anyways.

Regardless of the intent, it was classless and petty. It read like something out of the gossip rags they sell at grocery store checkouts.

Hurting a band like Dragonforce, whether they are false or not, has no good outcome. It's not going to boost up your underground heroes Kim.

On a side note I'd rather have annoying 13 year olds sperging out to Dragonforce than 'Little Weezy'. Sometimes shitty power metal is the lesser of two evils.
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little_raven



Joined: 17 Aug 2011
Posts: 1005

PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 7:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DIVERGENTSERIES wrote:
dronevil wrote:
I can't wait for some hipster journalist to dig up Alcest's "NS connections" and make a huge deal out of it hahaha. Then Deafheaven would become "nazi sympathisers" too and the hipsters BM listeners that came into the scene during the last few years can just leave the hall, as even the dearest media BM darlings had "dodgy pasts" or "dodgy connections".


The guitarist for Deafheaven already got busted for wearing a Hate Forest t-shirt by the hardcore kid google intelligentsia.



Also Agalloch's drummer having an amazing blog with some NSBM demos.
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IIIRD GATEKEEPER



Joined: 02 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hill Demoniac !!!
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