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Reinkaos
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Masterpiece or not
Yes
50%
 50%  [ 121 ]
No
49%
 49%  [ 120 ]
Total Votes : 241

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Tireheb



Joined: 18 Aug 2007
Posts: 11704
Location: Finland

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AK wrote:
Not a fan of the production, and the drumming is a huge step down from the previous album.

That's because Asklund is one of the worst drummers ever. Mr. shitty trigger.
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Xeniteia



Joined: 13 Feb 2008
Posts: 2702
Location: Rhône Valley, France

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

xyosefx wrote:
I don't even like to think of it as a Dissection album. The lyrics and presentation are great, but that music... ugh.


This is the main problem with this record and it was one of the highlights of something highly despicable in this scene: albums praised as masterpieces for ideological reasons despite having a weak musical content. This is the perfect example of lowlife attitude from the so-called satanic elite.
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Psalmanazar wrote:
I thought it was Dissection who reinvented black metal by adding back in the power ballads for everyone who wanted to show Steve Perry their lighter.


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haterofhumans



Joined: 21 Sep 2012
Posts: 1091
Location: Texas

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 10:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ragingwinter wrote:
Although the whole "Hail 218!" bullshit got old VERY quickly, I still love this album.

It seems to me, looking back at the footage a lot of these tracks were much more of an experience when witnessing them live.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaGKW2qAiDU


that's some lame happy riff shit right there
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altblood



Joined: 28 Jun 2011
Posts: 135

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tireheb wrote:

Only faggots like this album.

True. I think Jon took his life just because he wasn't able to endure the shame for this album.
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thus



Joined: 26 Jul 2012
Posts: 509
Location: Western Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 11:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This album does seem to exist in its own alternate universe for a lot of people.
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rthdx



Joined: 29 Apr 2010
Posts: 3371
Location: Korolev, Russia

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 11:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Xeniteia wrote:
This is the main problem with this record and it was one of the highlights of something highly despicable in this scene: albums praised as masterpieces for ideological reasons despite having a weak musical content. This is the perfect example of lowlife attitude from the so-called satanic elite.

Well, in this particular case ideological aspect is obviously over musical content, indeed. "Reinkaos" is fine album from the point of prison chanson; but I have to say I was never a huge fan of their earlier stuff back in the days, as melodic/death metal vibes in BM were never my cup of tea, in fact. Of corpse, only degenerate may argue songwriting/guitar skills of Jon. It was metioned "Black Album" as a comparison, but I'd better suggest "Swansong" of Carcass as more suitable, I think. There is also one more significant thing to mention - many more Swedes should follow his final choice, eventhough for many it's too late already to keep good memories about. Laughing
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xyosefx



Joined: 06 Aug 2009
Posts: 6518
Location: We lived among the people. I think you say "convenience store." We lived above it.

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 12:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ashes wrote:
Only faggots hate this album

Brilliantly argued. A masterpiece of logic and reasoning.
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Frozen



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 3497

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

xyosefx wrote:
Ashes wrote:
Only faggots hate this album

Brilliantly argued. A masterpiece of logic and reasoning.


Sometimes that's all it takes.
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Voidwards



Joined: 13 Oct 2010
Posts: 95

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 12:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's been raised previously, but the drumming is just so stale and uninspiring. I can't help but think how a less sterile sound and a better drummer might have helped.

Overall the album isn't bad, some good riffs are there. Not sure about the lyrics, they're very clearly ideological, I guess I've got nostalgic rose-tinted glasses when it comes down to the older stuff though.

Would people bother to defend it if it didn't have the Dissection logo on it?
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snt



Joined: 12 Aug 2010
Posts: 888
Location: Kazakhstan, Almaty

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 12:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Illumination wrote:
It's a good album, but doesn't hold a candle to their other two albums for me. So, I vote no.

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Miilos



Joined: 11 Jul 2011
Posts: 556

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 12:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Black Dragon is good song, but overall it's far from being good album. Of course, it's all a matter of taste, if someone is liking it - good for you, but I really wonder how many people who are saying this album is good would say the same if it's released by some random band.
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The Fallen



Joined: 08 May 2012
Posts: 703

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 1:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Voidwards wrote:


Would people bother to defend it if it didn't have the Dissection logo on it?


This.
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Frozen



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 3497

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 1:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The argument that "no one would have cared had the album been released by another band" just doesn't hold any water, as no other band could have created it. Period. The constant reference to In Flames is yet another example that the naysayers just don't know what they're talking about. There's a ton of dissonant chords in there, which is something In Flames never used, and let's not even get into the time signatures. It's just a completely different style.

I could spend hours pointing out why I hold the album in such high regard, but in the end it all comes down to personal preferences. I like REINKAOS. I like it more than anything that has been released after it. That's it.

An in-depth discussion about the album could be interesting, but I have the feeling that this isn't the time nor place.
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The Farthest Star



Joined: 01 Jun 2012
Posts: 399

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 1:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

george zaragkas wrote:
will i be an asshole if i write that i can understand someone that regards reinkaos to be a masterpiece if that someone is in his first steps to the aggressive sound (not even black metal).


I didn't like the album when it came out precisely because of it's modern metal flavor and polished sound but took a liking to it over time. And it's not like I'm the type that can get conditioned into "liking" something that I actually don't.

Also, I don't really think a lot of neophytes took a liking to Reinkaos. For all the In Flames comparisons, there's only a handful of riffs here that can be directly compared to In Flames and even then, you'd have to be thinking in that direction in the first place. After all, this is all directly derivative of classic metal, just tuned down to C and with more emphasis on mid paced stomping.

And speaking of In Flames comparisons and since they've predictably been raised in this thread - Jon's riffing is more involved than anything they ever wrote. If you're gonna compare Reinkaos to In Flames, might as well compare Iron Maiden with In Flames as well.

I mean fuck, I went out and explored melodeath hoping I'd find something that sounds like Reinkaos and I found nothing. All of it seems much poppier, angsty and lacking in grace and careful temper (speaking of songwriting here) that seems to be exclusive to Reinkaos.
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Transmission



Joined: 03 Aug 2012
Posts: 95
Location: England

PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Farthest Star wrote:
If you're gonna compare Reinkaos to In Flames, might as well compare Iron Maiden with In Flames as well.

I mean fuck, I went out and explored melodeath hoping I'd find something that sounds like Reinkaos and I found nothing. All of it seems much poppier, angsty and lacking in grace and careful temper (speaking of songwriting here) that seems to be exclusive to Reinkaos.


I quite like the album - but then again I've managed to remain almost entirely ignorant of 'melodeath'. I mean, I know At The Gates and later Carcass, but I don't think I've ever heard In Flames or Dark Tranquillity (etc etc) in my life.

I get that Reinkaos is tainted by association by such bands (and I trust that these melodeath bands are genuinely awful) - but perhaps in my ignorance I just got a Maidenish 'old metal' vibe from Dissection. There's more to 'old metal' than Venom and Sodom or whatever, and Dissection caught that melodic 80s vibe for me.

It isn't my favourite album by any means, but perhaps my blissful ignorance of these other guilt-by-association bands allows me to enjoy the album in a way that other people can't get!
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